The Heathen Hub

A community where people can talk about atheism, religion, science, humanism, evolution, politics, Creationism, literature, reason, rational enquiry, logic, cooking, reading, travel and life.

Spacer
To select different styles:

Spacer Go Back   The Heathen Hub   >  General   >  Religion and Atheism in general
Reload this Page On the Afterlife
Spacer

Spacer   Spacer

Reply

On the Afterlife

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 22-Feb-2010, 01:04 AM (01:04)     1        37229
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Eye Of Sauron On the Afterlife

Gurdur, your post inspired me to make another thread.

I don't believe in an afterlife because I think it makes for an excuse not to live this life to the fullest... I've seen too many people uselessly trying to rack up brownie points for heaven to care much about what God or anyone else thinks about my efforts in life, as long as I wake up happy and go to sleep with a clear conscience.

Besides, if the Christians are right, I'm headed for hell no matter how you wanna slice it. Rejection of the Holy Spirit, apostasy, and unforgivable sins, FTW.

What do the rest of you think on the afterlife?
__________________
"Time once again for an important GNR public service announcement! Don't feed the yao guai. That is all." ~Three Dog

"Remember kids, a smart man knows when it's time to run like a little bitch!" ~Kanta, Desert Punk
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 02:47 AM (02:47)     2        37231
alicat
faithless and unreasonable
 
member


Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 586
Default

Whether there is or not, we do go on, family, kids, friends, you never know how your life might have little repercussion thru the centuries. Even the body is never really gone, I might end up as a tree or a blade of grass, then maybe some animal will eat it. It's an interesting mental exercise to sit under a big old tree at a park or somewhere, think of the person who planted it, those who took care of it, others who spent time under it, kids playing, lovers kissing, people resting in the shade and besides people, all the wildlife that's come and gone, everything that's influenced this particular spot.
alicat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 06:14 AM (06:14)     3        37237
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Default

I can totally see that point of view, and can agree with the ripple effect and whatnot, but I saw this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by alicat View Post
Even the body is never really gone, I might end up as a tree or a blade of grass, then maybe some animal will eat it.
And all I could think was this:


Sorry. >.>
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 10:01 AM (10:01)     4        37240
Gurdur
Very professional penguin
 
Gurdur's Avatar
 
administrator


Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,332
Blog Entries: 1022
Default

That is why I love good, old graveyards. There is a lot to say about graveyards. I would prefer to be buried myself under a plum sapling.
Gurdur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 01:00 PM (13:00)     5        37241
alicat
faithless and unreasonable
 
member


Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 586
Default

My grandmother got cremated, we buried her ashes on my parents farm and planted a ginkgo tree.

lol- on the video- pretty much.
alicat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 04:17 PM (16:17)     6        37243
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Default

I can't say I much care how I end up after I'm dead, as long as I don't go on the donor table. I don't know why, but that bothers me. It's sort of like giving blood... Stuff that's supposed to be in, going out, is just sooo not cool.

I've told my family that if anything ever happens, to just put me in a shoebox somewhere. If they feel the need to spend money, have a big party with good food and music and dancing.
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Feb-2010, 09:30 PM (21:30)     7        37280
alicat
faithless and unreasonable
 
member


Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 586
Default

And they put my great-uncle's ashes in the garage til they decided where to spread him, then my grandfather decided to clean out the garage, guess who was included in the purge of things to the curb, oops, it was an honest mistake.

I'd rather be burned and put on the curb, than embalmed and buried, donor table would be fine, but I wouldn't want to be in the anatomy lab for students.
alicat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-Jun-2010, 07:25 AM (07:25)     8        39834
Seer
Member
 
Seer's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North California
Posts: 83
Default

I see it like this; we get only the moment. This one. Always. After all, forever and ever until now, the "you" that you identify with in this moment made it this far...(all awareness is one -- your awareness and mine and a bird's and a tree's is the same awareness, just with different conditional parameters).

It all boils down to awareness, doesn't it? If you are aware and awake in this moment, what concern is there for a tomorrow? (or an afterlife? or a yesterday for that matter?) And if you trust (some say have faith) that the moment contains everything that is, then why be concerned about another time (afterlife) or place (heaven)? You're already here, and its all here, right now. Better to live, fully aware, awake to the moment.

The alternative is to sleep now and dream of time that never comes.
__________________
"Have the fearless attitude of a hero and the loving heart of a child." Soyen Shaku
Seer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-Jun-2010, 08:08 AM (08:08)     9        39835
Gurdur
Very professional penguin
 
Gurdur's Avatar
 
administrator


Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,332
Blog Entries: 1022
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alicat View Post
And they put my great-uncle's ashes in the garage til they decided where to spread him, then my grandfather decided to clean out the garage, guess who was included in the purge of things to the curb, oops, it was an honest mistake.
In Travels With My Aunt, by Graham Greene, the main protaganist, Henry, has his deceased mother cremated. In the course of events, he leaves the urn containing his mother's ashes at the home of his aunt, Aunt Augusta, who has suddenly turned up after an absence of many decades.

Aunt Augusta's valet dumps most of the ashes to hide some marijuana in the urn; the police confiscate what is left of the ashes as a result, leaving Henry ash-less.

Under the further influence of his aunt, Henry, an English, just-retired bank-manager who till then has lived a wholly blameless life, goes off to Paraguay to eventually become a major drug-runner and to marry the young daughter of the local police chief.


Quote:
I'd rather be burned and put on the curb, than embalmed and buried, donor table would be fine, but I wouldn't want to be in the anatomy lab for students.
Most subjects here who end up for the students are poor people who got a free funeral out of it; their body parts are eventually cremated and the urns buried in marked plots.

Last edited by Gurdur; 21-Jun-2010 at 08:17 AM (08:17).
Gurdur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-Jun-2010, 09:40 PM (21:40)     10        39837
Never
Admin
 
Never's Avatar
 
administrator


Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Ohio
Posts: 726
Blog Entries: 10
Default

I don't believe there is any afterlife. I find the concept a bit too far-fetched. Besides, if there were I know my mother would have smacked me for not keeping her house clean enough - so there's my proof.

If events should transpire that I was brain-dead and had organs people could use, have at it. I'd love to think that I allowed someone else to enjoy some years of life that they wouldn't have had otherwise.

No to having students poke around me. I know I'm not there, but ew.
I need to think some more on burial vs cremation.
Never is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Jun-2010, 04:12 AM (04:12)     11        39838
alicat
faithless and unreasonable
 
member


Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 586
Default

what should it be?
I mean, just for fun, hypothetically if there was an afterlife.
What would you want to do when you're dead?
alicat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Jun-2010, 04:29 AM (04:29)     12        39839
Gurdur
Very professional penguin
 
Gurdur's Avatar
 
administrator


Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,332
Blog Entries: 1022
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alicat View Post
... What would you want to do when you're dead?
All the things I would have been arrested for had I been alive.
Gurdur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Jun-2010, 06:36 AM (06:36)     13        39840
333
self-transforming machine elf
 
333's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Qliphothic Malkuth
Posts: 1,265
Blog Entries: 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alicat View Post
what should it be?
I mean, just for fun, hypothetically if there was an afterlife.
What would you want to do when you're dead?
Self inflicting emotional and sexual Hell... erm... Kittens and lollipops yeah...I go with that.
333 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-Jun-2010, 06:59 AM (06:59)     14        39843
Seer
Member
 
Seer's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: North California
Posts: 83
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by alicat View Post
what should it be?
I mean, just for fun, hypothetically if there was an afterlife.
What would you want to do when you're dead?
Travel. Obscure places. Like, Mars, just to see what color the sky really is from the surface. I'm betting on a pale blue, and not on the rusty color NASA "corrects" the images they release to the public. And all the earth-like planets that have organic life, just to see what various other living matter and ecosystems might be like. Otherwise, I'd just hang out on a tropical beach somewhere with friends and family, enjoy their company, their music, and share sunsets in the evening.

Even so, I wonder why anyone thinks that "being dead" is even possible. When you consider dead is "not". Being "not" before being born into this world...and seeming to make it here just fine being "dead" before arriving, gives me comfort. Maybe we are giving too much credence to this temporary domain, and after our little "lifetime" stint, actually get to return to being in true form (or formless-ness).
Seer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-Jun-2010, 12:15 AM (00:15)     15        39865
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Default

You know, I can't imagine what I'd do if I were around after I died. Hang out in dark alleys and shake chains to scare the shit out of random people, I guess.
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-Jun-2010, 02:51 AM (02:51)     16        39867
homo hirsutus
Getting hairier by the minute.
 
member


Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Hangout
Posts: 217
Blog Entries: 3
Default

I would give a try at walking all the way around the world or something fun like that. Go all the places I'm afraid to go while I have a life to lose, like Afghanistan or New Jersey.
homo hirsutus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-Jun-2010, 11:46 PM (23:46)     17        39869
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Default

LOL. New Jersey.
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-Jul-2010, 03:52 PM (15:52)     18        40148
Grumpy
Crusty old Fart
 
Grumpy's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Across the street from the Purple Cow
Posts: 557
Send a message via Yahoo to Grumpy
Default

Hey, folks, I usually hang out at the Hangout. I lurk here occasionally. Most of your names are unfamiliar to me, as I assume mine is to you.

This thread triggered a memory I feel like sharing.

I lived for a little over 12 years in Belize, Central America. Where I lived was a small town way to the southern, undeveloped end of the country. About 2000-3000 people when I arrived.

The cemetery there was creepy enough to provide a set for "Creature Features" intro. It was about 250 years old, and was situated right across the street from 'The Hospital Where No One Survives'.

Three friends and I were sitting in my living room just having a general bull session. Three of us were confirmed atheists, and one was a recovering Christian with one foot still firmly in the church.

One of the guys said, "Grumpy, the way you keep coming down with malaria, you are likely to die before any of us. What do you want us to do with your body? Do you want to be cremated or buried?

About a year or so prior to this conversation a friend had died with instructions to cremate his remains. It was an ordeal. There are no facilities for cremation in Belize, and it is illegal to just build a fire and do it. We finally found a fruit-dehydration plant about 180 miles to the North that was willing to do it. But we had to pay serious money to have it done, and then to completely clean and sanitize the oven. It took days, because the oven wasn't really hot enough, and Bob had had to be completely dessicated like a raisin before he would catch fire. Raised such a stink I thought they must be puking in Guatemala.

I suggested the boys just drag my fat ass out to the jungle and leave me for the ants and jaguars. Don't go to the trouble of cremating me, and please don't put me in that cemetery.

The christer was ok with this, to my surprise, and so was Birdman (a friend who is now a member of the other board, but never posts there). But a strong objection was raised by the other guy. He was (still is) a marine biologist who obsesses about mollusks. A life-long atheist who had been raised by scientist parents who were atheists themselves.

Whenever a religious person asked him about his own religion, he would say, "Thank my lucky stars, I'm not superstitious."

He exclaimed that this was a heartless and cruel suggestion, uncivilized and barbaric. He actually became angry at our attempts to convince him of the sensibleness of my request.
Grumpy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-Jul-2010, 03:56 PM (15:56)     19        40149
Gurdur
Very professional penguin
 
Gurdur's Avatar
 
administrator


Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,332
Blog Entries: 1022
Default

People are strange. I can understand the problems with the oven; cremation is much more difficult than people imagine.

I once heard about one crematorium oven in Britain almost having its doors blown right off in a small explosion (and they were specially strengthened doors), because the widow of the bloke who was cremated had put in two cans of RentoKill pesticide spray in with the body, apparently because her husband loved to use the stuff so much.
Gurdur is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-Jul-2010, 11:47 PM (23:47)     20        40151
homo hirsutus
Getting hairier by the minute.
 
member


Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: The Hangout
Posts: 217
Blog Entries: 3
Default

Wow, just wow.
homo hirsutus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 27-Jul-2012, 02:56 PM (14:56)     21        45333
Shadowfox
The Hub's RL Senior
 
member


Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: The Great State of Confusion
Posts: 281
Default

Browsing and just found this thread.

Afterlife to me is what happens after life. Before "I" was, I was not. After "I" am, I wil not be. So for "life" afterlife, no way I say.

After reading about lots of researches done into the mind which generally conclude that the mind is non local and non temporal, I wonder if my mind will continue after my body dies. But I doubt if it does that I will be me. What was "I" could then be part of a lot of "I's" but not the individual that I am when my body is alive. Fanciful? Probably. But some stuff I think about now and then.

As for my having a "soul" that survives after my body dies, that seems too farfetched for me to believe. I think I get one shot, the idea that I go around only once so go for all the gusto in this life.

All the different religious beliefs have differing interpretations of what happens after death - some sort of heaven or hell, or reincarnation (being born again and again and again. . ,) pleasure or punishment, or being somewhere that we live but do not know who we were. I reckon it's the fear of death, of not being, that is what scares humanity into wishful thinking.

Besides a lot of religious folk already "know" that I am damned to eternal fire and brimstone. I say I'm already in hell since I live here among them.

Ok, as to my "afterlife." Once that which is "I" is gone from its body, I won't care what happens to it. But I have instructed my exec - and already preauthorized it - for cremation and scatter the ashes on my land if it's still owned by my estate. I want to go to wind and not be sealed into a solid box so that my body will be preserved for some supposed ultimate resurrection. Then no funeral or memorial service - have a party!
Shadowfox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-Aug-2012, 12:44 AM (00:44)     22        45350
Seeker630
Senior Member
 
Seeker630's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Way Down Yonder in the Paw Paw Patch
Posts: 330
Default

Yeah I know this is a two year old thread, but what the hell, I never posted in it back then, and it hasn't been closed.

Christianity is driven by the afterlife. Without it, there is no Christianity. There is no need for it, or any other religion that espouses that there is such a thing. I have never had a single religious person explain to me the logistics of just how one is punished or rewarded after they no longer exist. Does this all powerful god being re-create us with a new body after we've been dead for a thousand years solely for the purpose of extracting the heavenly revenge?

And lets face it----that's exactly what we're talking about here. Are we then punished as infants, or as 90 year olds? Or does it make any difference? Maybe we could be punished as a zygote in a Petri dish or something. But then the ordinary purpose of any kind of punishment in a sane world is to correct a behavior------yes? Eternal punishment offers no opportunity for redemption or correction. So what other purpose could it possibly serve? Only a sick, twisted fuck could come up with such an idea.

There is no purpose I can discern for the concept of eternal torture of a dead person, beyond revenge for offenses either real or imagined. Beside that, there is absolutely no evidence of any kind that has ever been offered to support the notion that we somehow, somewhere, enter into any kind of a life after the one we have expires.
Seeker630 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-Aug-2012, 07:43 PM (19:43)     23        45359
Makbawehuh
Doctor Ragnarok
 
Makbawehuh's Avatar
 
member


Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: The darkest corners of your imagination. Or maybe right next to you. I'm not telling!
Posts: 4,015
Blog Entries: 170
Default

What always gets me is that the punishment, ultimately, is based on 1) An act that was not the fault of the person being punished (after all, all sin comes from Original Sin!), and 2) Something that the people who committed the terrible crime could not possibly be held accountable for if people applied just a little bit of logic (Adam and Eve could not have possibly understood the moral implications of disobedience, as they had no concept of good and evil prior to committing said crime).

So, yeah. Eternal punishment with no chance for redemption or correction, ultimately for a crime that no one committed, and which wasn't really a crime to begin with.

Pretty sick, indeed.
Makbawehuh is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 09:31 PM (21:31).

       

Credits and thanks:
Basic Style design: Design By: Miner Skinz.com
(much altered by Gurdur)

For smilies:

Koloboks, including Aiwan, ViShenk, Just Cuz, Laie, Connie, snoozer, Viannen,
and especially Mother Goose too.
KitKatty. and PederDingo, and phantompanther.

For help, coding, and/or modifications:

Different people at vBulletin.com, and a whole lot of people -- too many to be individually named, sorry -- at vBulletin.org

For artwork, avatars, backgrounds and so on:

KitKatty, and verte, and britpoplass


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright is asserted for the Heathen Hub itself and for its owner by its owner, from 2008 onwards. Copyright of individual posts remains the property of the original poster, however by posting on the Hub the poster grants the Hub the rights to host and present the posted messages for perpetuity. The Hub is in no way responsible for opinions or messages posted in any way on the Hub by its members. Please also see this here. Copyright of individual icons and other graphics, as for individual vBulletin styles, remains the property of the original owner/creator. Copyright for the vBulletin software itself, and the vBulletin Blogs software, remains with Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd, as in the copyright notice above.
Welcome to a place to talk about atheism, religion, science, humanism, evolution, politics, Creationism, literature, reason, rational inquiry, logic, cooking, reading, and travel - the Hub: a community for everyone.